By
Ryan Sparks – December 2008
What can one say about bassist Billy
Sheehan that hasn’t been repeated countless times before?
Only a select few musicians really deserve to be called a
virtuoso but when you consider the players who have truly
mastered their respective instruments and are as dedicated
to the craft of music as he is, there’s just no way you
could possibly leave someone like Billy off the list.
No matter what musical endeavour Billy has been involved in
over the course of over thirty years in the
business, he’s always been a consummate professional and
given 110% to every project. Whether working with industry
heavyweight Dave Lee Roth post Van Halen in the mid 80’s to
tasting commercial success with his own band Mr. Big,
Sheehan has been fortunate enough to reap the rewards for
his efforts. He has worked or continues to work with some of
the finest musicians on the planet, which is no surprise as
greatness naturally gravitates towards greatness. Billy’s
latest project is a power trio called Devil’s Slingshot in
which he locks horns with two fellow maestro’s in
guitarist Tony MacAlpine and drummer Virgil Donati. Their
debut release Clinophobia which has just been issued
stateside via Mascot Records is a colossal collection of
deep grooves and thick, meaty instrumental rock jams, that
more than allows each musician their moment in the
spotlight, and I recently caught up with Billy to get the
low down on this exciting new project.
Speaking with Billy is a true labour of love as not only is
he an extremely relaxed and down to earth individual with a
great sense of humour, but more importantly a great deal of
humility as well. Read on to find out more about Devil’s
Slingshot as he offers some very insightful comments on the
musical personalities of each individual. Billy also
willingly discussed the music that inspires and influences
him and why he still buys CD’s. If that wasn’t enough he
also gave me some info on Niacin’s future plans as well as
his third solo CD which will be out in the first quarter of
2009.
Ryan: Devil’s
Slingshot is a true power trio in every sense of the word.
Can you tell me a little bit about the genesis of this
project? Tony was the catalyst behind it correct?
Billy: Yeah Tony and Virgil put this together, of course we
all played together with Steve Vai on the tour where we
recorded the Live At The Astoria DVD. Virgil went his own
way and left the band soon after that. Tony and I had played
together a lot so they contacted me about doing some stuff
on the record. Although I didn’t play on the whole record I
did play on a bunch of tracks. Unfortunately or maybe
fortunately with budget cutbacks and everything these days
records are often put together piece by piece. To get
everybody together in the same spot can get expensive and
time consuming. So they sent me the stuff to listen to and
check out and I laid some bass down on it. It’s mostly Tony
and Virgil’s vision musically – often when I play on someone
else’s record I’ll ask them and give them the option if they
want me to do my thing, or should it be 50-50, and this kind
of worked out that way. They gave me the basic foundation,
which had certain boundaries and then I also had the
opportunity for me to do what I felt would be the correct
thing in there as well. It was an interesting challenge
because the music has a lot of exotic twists and turns so it
definitely challenged me. I had to dig deep into my bag of
tricks to come with some ways to fit things in [laughing],
but it was cool.
Ryan: I noticed that for reasons you probably just
mentioned, that you weren’t involved in the song writing.
I’m assuming that this was due to Tony and Virgil having a
large chunk of the material written beforehand. Do you hope
to be more involved in the song writing process for the
band’s next recording?
Billy: Yeah they were on tour in France for a whole summer
behind a French artist, I forgot his name (ed note: Michel
Polnareff) but he’s like the Frank Sinatra or Elvis of
France. There were hundreds of thousands of people at these
huge shows and I’ve found myself in those kinds of
situations as well. When you’re on those big tours you find
yourself with a lot of time off waiting for the next show.
So I’m sure they had a lot of time to write during that time
period and I think that’s where most of this material came
from. If I was involved in writing something for a project
like this – Niacin is more what I lean towards if I’m going
to do something like this, because there was a time in my
life when I was very much into progressive rock and fusion,
which I still am to a large degree but I’m still basically a
rock player. So if I was to write something for a project
like this it would probably sound a little bit like what I
do in Niacin I think. Virgil is quite a different drummer
than Dennis (Chambers) so I might think more King Crimson
than Return to Forever if that make any sense [laughing].
Ryan: If someone looks at this recording and thinks
alright its you, Tony McAlpine and Virgil Donati and it’s
all instrumental so it must be three supremely talented
musicians showing off their respective chops. How would you
respond to that and at the same time explain how this
project differs from all the other recordings you’ve
appeared on in your career?
Billy: Well just that anytime you get three different people
together it’s always going to be different, even if it’s the
same three people at a different time, its going to be
different. It’s hard to keep such a living art form like
music static because it will always change and evolve.
Everyday I’m always working on my bass playing. Last night I
spent a solid hour working on some hard and intense stuff,
just recovering lost things that I did forty years ago, but
also coming up with new stuff and improving what I already
have. Improving doesn’t always mean playing it faster but
better and more solid, so it’s always moving. Any record in
my humble opinion is a snapshot of a moment and this record
is a moment of three individuals.
Generally I opt more towards singing and song based records
although I haven’t done as many of those in recent years as
I’ve done in the past. My solo records have a lot of singing
on them and I usually forewarn people in advance that I’m
going to be singing [laughing]. This record is an
interesting snapshot of three players who all have extensive
backgrounds, and what happens when we collaborate. It is
unique and an acquired taste for sure. I wouldn’t expect
someone that’s into your typical, average stock rock music
to gravitate towards it. However, hopefully if they listen
to it, it might twist them in a different direction, which
is what happened to me as a fan when I would get exposed to
something that was outside of my boundaries. Something that
would make think a little differently about the stuff I
already liked, and at the same time maybe expand it a little
bit more. That’s why I always enjoyed in the old days, the
old prehistoric days, if I heard Emerson, Lake & Palmer
doing “Pictures At An Exhibition”. I would wonder who this
Mussorgsky guy is, sure enough I’d track down some of his
orchestral pieces and suddenly I’m a fan. Hopefully
something like that would occur.
Ryan: As a musician and also as a fan of music it’s always
important to revisit the source where some of this stuff
comes from isn’t it?
Billy: Exactly and I like that a lot. I got an Albert King
record years ago and I found about four Led Zeppelin songs
on it, not knowing that Albert King had done them first
[laughing].
Ryan: I think there were quite a few Zeppelin songs like
that [laughing].
Billy: No kidding its amazing! “Killing Floor” was “The
Lemon Song”. It’s almost identical, even the solo is almost
the same.
Ryan: There were times where they gave credit but other
times I think they just nicked stuff figuring maybe no would
notice.
Billy: Yeah I tend to believe that it’s more they just
forgot, because just the nature and the spirit of those
guys, they loved that stuff and they gave it as much credit
as possible. Not to lump myself in the same category as Led
Zeppelin by far, but there’s a lot of stuff that I – they
say good writers write and great writers steal. On my solo
stuff I’m always glad when someone points it out and gets it
and will say “Does this come from…?” and I’ll say “Yeah as a
matter of fact that was exactly the influence etc…” I
recently got some stuff by this old artist that most people
probably haven’t heard about these days, a guy named Anthony
Newley. He was a sort of show tunes, Broadway type singer
and as far as I know, and I may be wrong but that’s kind of
where David Bowie got his voice from. It’s very, very Bowie
this early Anthony Newley, so it’s pretty interesting stuff.
There’s always somebody who came before. For me it was Tim
Bogart, Paul Samwell- Smith, Jack Bruce and a whole long
list. As far as Devils Slingshot goes there’s a whole lot of
stuff of a similar nature that came before us, King Crimson,
Gentle Giant, all the early Genesis I’m a huge fan of,
things like that.
Ryan: You’ve known Tony for a long time, from playing on
his debut solo album Edge of Insanity over twenty years ago,
to touring with him and Virgil in Steve Vai’s band like you
mentioned. How would you compare his methods of composing
and playing with Steve’s for example?
Billy: Well Tony is a classical musician; he can sit down at
the piano and do Rachmaninoff, Liszt, Chopin, and Mozart and
nail it, for real. I mean how difficult it must be for
someone to walk out onstage with a grand piano and be able
to pull of a piece by one of these composers, but Tony can
do that. That is a quantum, quantum leap above most
musicians that I know on earth and that is a tough gig.
Where some guitarists go back and learn some classical
things on keyboards etc…, Tony in fact was a classical
pianist first and I think that really sets him apart from a
lot of musicians in that he really understands composition.
It goes very deep with him and his ear is such that if you
take a quarter and hit it off your beer bottle he’ll tell
you it’s an A flat [laughing]. We checked it and in fact it
is an A flat, we thought he was smoking us but it really is
[laughing]. So he is really fined tuned into the expertise
of being a player and a composer and I’ve never seen
anything he couldn’t play on guitar. Steve is more of an
eclectic mix of Zappa / Stravinsky composition. I was glad
also for the David Lee Roth Eat ‘em and Smile influence on
Steve’s playing because I think he’s more accessible now
more because of that more than anything else. That really
gave him a sense of what was required to reach more people,
compared to the relatively smaller amount of people that
Stravinsky and Zappa reach, though I would certainly say a
much more sophisticated group of people for sure. Tony just
has a huge depth and understanding of music, sound,
composition in a classical sense whereas Steve is an
eclectic mix of a lot of 20th Century things, and a
brilliant combiner and composer as well.
Ryan: Over the years you’ve played with or continue to
play with drummers that have extensive jazz backgrounds,
from Greg Bissonette, Dennis Chambers, and Virgil as well.
As far as a composer or player what do you find is unique
about him?
Billy: Virgil is quite exotic and abstract and he makes
twists and turns that are quite wild. As a bass player quite
frankly it’s a real challenge because sometimes I have to
just hang in there and peddle eighth or sixteenth notes to
stabilize a foundation for him, and let him go. In actual
fact that requires me to be a more basic player when I play
with a wilder drummer, as opposed to when I’m playing with
someone who’s more of a basic drummer and I have a little
bit more room to move. I love a challenge and I don’t always
like to play the same thing. I like to be faced sometimes
with things that are tougher or more difficult for me to do,
or require an immense amount of selflessness on my part
[laughing]. In this gig, especially performing live I really
have to pull back, hold things together and let Virgil do
his thing which is unusual for me. It’s not necessarily my
first choice of things to do but in this situation it’s
required. So it is as much an exercise in personal
discipline in a musical sense, in that I’m always trying to
listen to the big picture and listen to the band as a whole.
If it’s an eclectic mix of abstract craziness it isn’t going
to work. Somebody’s got to be in there laying a foundation
down and if no one else is doing it I’m going to volunteer
right away and jump in there to find that spot and hold it
[laughing].
Ryan: What happens when you have both yourself and the
drummer wanting to lead and neither of you wants to hold
back?
Billy: It absolutely can work but it requires both us to be
really, really in synch. When I play with Dennis Chambers,
if I may impose upon him with this statement, we really
think alike when we play together. So when he moves I move
in the same way. If you’re locked in with the drummer you
can do just about anything. When I can predict what the
drummer is going to do or guess accurately, do that and lock
in with him then it works great. Virgil is a little more
unpredictable which in a way is good because I don’t know
what the heck is coming. I have to kind of step back, hold
on and jump ahead in time and prepare for just about
anything, and that’s an interesting challenge. Drums and
bass can go nuts together and go absolutely psychotic wild
as long as they synch together, because then it all somehow
works. I’ve actually gotten away with a lot more aggressive
playing than I might have only because all I do is watch the
drummer. The first thing I learned about bass, before I even
owned one, was when the drummer hits his bass drum you play
a bass note at the same time. When he hits the snare or toms
you make sure you’re playing bass notes on top of those also
if you want to. However, the first thing I learned before
even owning a bass was that you had to play with the bass
drum, and to expand on that to play with the other drums. If
you can do that then you can get away with a lot more. I
think I got away with a lot of eclectic playing because it
was always locked into the drummer and I’ve always worked
with drummers that I could synch with. Now Virgil I can
synch with but sometimes it’s such an abstraction that I
have to sometimes pull back and hold things underneath which
is a whole different world, and again it’s a challenge and I
enjoy it. I enjoy that challenge of having to pop underneath
him and hold things together while he goes off. He’s a very
special and unique drummer, there’s nobody like him.
Ryan: One of the first things I noticed on Clinophobia
with regards to your playing is that it sounds a little more
restrained than usual.
Billy: Absolutely. For me the overall sound of what’s going
on is the best. I really do listen to what’s going on with
the whole band when I’m up there. I lock into the drummer
and I listen to the whole band. If things are kind of shaky
and falling apart then I want to pull back and play a big
giant whole note on a low root just to make sure everyone
knows where we’re standing [laughing]
Ryan: Mascot Records has just issued your debut album
Clinophobia here in North America so many people on this
side of the pond are just getting their first taste of
Devil’s Slingshot while fans in Europe have had the
opportunity to witness the band live via a couple of Euro
tours in 2006 & 2007. Does the possibility of an extended
run of shows over here exist or is there generally more of a
demand for this kind of music over in Europe?
Billy: I think there’s a demand for it everywhere and it’s
just a matter of aligning audiences, bands, venues and
dates. In my experience as I’ve travelled around, because
things are so decentralized these days it’s easy to get the
impression that something may or may not be popular or
supported. However, with enough footwork I’ve seen crowds
show up for very abstract things. It’s actually in a way
easier to find people now because you can go on the internet
and group together all the people who are into a type of
music or whatever, coordinate that and get shows to happen.
The European shows were very, very well attended and they
were all in the plus column as far as being financially
viable, which is important because you cant go on tour and
break even or lose money because its just not practical
anymore. So I’m sure it would be possible, but when or how
that might happen I’m not sure. I love to tour and love to
perform live and any opportunity I have I jump on it
instantly. If that opportunity does arise I can assure you
I’ll be there.
Ryan: This segues perfectly into my next question. You’ve
always maintained a vigorous work schedule both with your
own projects as well as your collaborations with other
artists. Do you ever feel that there’s just not enough time
in the day to accomplish everything? For example do you ever
find yourself having to turn down offers due to your busy
schedule?
Billy: Absolutely. Just this week I had to turn down three
recording projects because I just can’t squeeze it in.
Twenty four hours is just not a long enough day and I wish
somebody could do something about that. Maybe if they
extended it to twenty eight or thirty hours it might help
[laughing]. There’s a lot going on but that’s good because I
love it and I don’t do much else other than music. If I’m
not actually playing and writing then I’m in my little home
studio with my iTunes. On my hard drive here I’ve got at
current count over 57,000 songs which is a finely tuned
collection. It’s not just random stuff but music that I’m
actually into and that’s influenced me. I guess I’m keeping
the CD business in the black because I just purchased about
a thousand dollars of CD’s from Amazon [laughing]. It’s all
great stuff and I’ve got some great collections and
compilations. I’m also tracking down older records that I
loved in the early days and ones I wasn’t able to find on
CD, I have found now. For example the band Paris which had
the original bassist from Jethro Tull, with Bob Welch
singing, it’s pretty cool stuff from the early 70’s.
Ryan: Not only is there not enough time in the day to
make music as a musician but as a fan there isn’t enough
time in the day to listen to it either.
Billy: Yeah I’m still archiving and finding stuff that I
grew up on, and there’s some great new stuff as well. Once
and awhile I’ll hear some new stuff that I like and I’m
almost disappointed because then I’ll have to go and by all
their other stuff.
Ryan: I find I spend a lot of my time digging back in
time. Usually its by word of mouth or something I’ll read,
I’ll try to track this stuff down, find out its great and
then wonder why I never heard of a particular artist or band
you know? It’s a continuous thing for me.
Billy: True, true. It expands back in time and into the
future as well, so that would be the definition of the
candle burning at both ends as far as that goes [laughing].
I’m a fan and I love sitting down and – I discover some new
things once and awhile but sometimes I discover new old
things.
Ryan: The days of lavish record company spending, with
large advances and piles of money being thrown around
frivolously for recording have seemingly come to an end,
with the Axl Rose led Guns ‘n Roses being a model for how
not to do things.
Billy: No kidding.
Ryan: So how does an honest musician like yourself and so
many others manage to make a living in this day and age as
record companies are not only trying to find a new model of
how to operate but also as more established acts are
securing exclusive deals and aligning themselves with major
retailers such as Best Buy at the same time?
Billy: Well the other side of that coin is the digital
recording revolution which has allowed anyone with a
computer and a minimal amount of equipment to be on the same
playing field as the superstar millionaire. You can make a
record as good or better if you’ve got a laptop and an
interface. It is possible. If I remember Alanis Morissette’s
Jagged Little Pill was done on ADAT which is a far cry
quality wise from what you can do now with a laptop and an
interface. That’s the good side; you don’t need a really
huge budget. You don’t need hundreds of thousands of
dollars. I’ve seen records come in for two or three thousand
dollars which is very, very reasonable, so it is possible.
Also they can’t take live music away from us. We will always
have the ability to perform live. As much as the big labels
are gone, some people think that’s a bad thing but in a way
I think it’s a good thing because a lot of them were
populated by people who weren’t into music. They were into
making cash and the bottom line. They were answering to the
accountants and bean counters whereas now anybody who has a
label or is into the music business now on the record
business side or like yourself on the journalistic side, you
guys are into music and you’re in it for real because you
love it. I’m sure you’ve seen it. Anybody who’s at a record
label now, my partner Mike is with Metal Blade, they love
their jobs and they love their bands, and they’re into it
you know what I mean? They have hundred thousand dollar
budgets but they love what they do and they’re into it man.
The people from Mascot and the guy who runs it is the same
way, what a great guy. He loves music. He’s got vintage
Marshall’s that he brought down to the show for Tony to try
one time. He’s a real music lover and not into getting rich
from music, he’s into music enriching him.
Ryan: I guess the tables have been turning because a lot
of these people who are starting these upstart labels were
fans of music first.
Billy: Yeah and that’s how it was when the music business
turned into the music industry. It’s no longer an industry
anymore, it’s a business and it’s much smaller. In a way I’m
glad, even though I’d be a liar if I said I wouldn’t mind a
1.5 million dollar advance to finance a record, a tour and
pay for the catering and the massages. That’s nice but I’m a
fan. I like music and I like to play, and all that other
stuff gets in the way of that.
Ryan: I would be remiss if I didn’t ask you how your
latest solo CD is coming along as well as Niacin’s future
plans.
Billy: Niacin will be starting to write pretty soon for the
next record and probably right after the holidays we’ll be
putting it together. My new CD which will be my third solo
record is called Holy Cow. It has some amazing guests on it
and it will coming out in February or March on Mascot
Records. Ray Luzier plays drums, he’s playing with Korn now
and just did a Stone Temple Pilots tour. He’s a great, great
drummer and played on Cosmic Troubadour as well. Tony (MacAlpine)
did a classical piano piece over a Bach bass thing that I
did. Doug Pinnick came in and sang a track amazingly, he
just killed it. Paul Gilbert from Mr. Big did an amazing
solo on one track, and last but not least Billy Gibbons laid
some guitar down on another song I wrote with him in mind.
He’s a genius and a living legend. It’s one of the greatest
honours I’ve ever had in my life to have him play on my
record. He just kicked ass, it was awesome [laughing].
Ryan: Last question for you. After over 30 years as a
professional musician what is the most important thing
you’ve discovered about yourself as person?
Billy: Good question. I think probably that I’m able to
recover from loss. You see it when a team is down at the
half and the other team has just clobbered them, whatever
sport it is. To come back from behind is a tough thing to
do. I was somehow blessed with the ability to come from
behind. Life throws you some losses, because it’s not easy
in the music business and there are a lot of setbacks. I
could concentrate on the setbacks; many of which are not as
well known than the things that have made me successful of
course. However for every successful action there are
usually five to seven huge setbacks and disappointments. I
think the ability to recover from a setback is something
that I’m supremely thankful for. I’ve been incredibly lucky
to have had some great success and a lot of my dreams have
come true, but every time the referee held my hand up as the
winner, you didn’t see the six times I got knocked down to
the floor [laughing]. It’s good to be able to get back up
again and I think as an artist - any artist who reads this
understands that it’s a sensitive thing. People go after you
or your playing, they’ll say something negative or even just
say no they don’t like it. To still be able to come back and
write and do better, to try and top it and show them they’re
wrong and you can do better. It’s a tough thing as an
artist, so I consider myself extremely lucky to have a
little of that built into my personality somehow.
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